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  • Tax

    More property taxes proposed



    Just read this on Sky news

    LINK

    As well as a cap, underwritten by Government, the Green Paper is likely to propose a saving or insurance scheme for young people.

    A cap on "punitive" costs will form part of the Government's social care reforms, Health Secretary Jeremy Hunt has said.

    In a move that would reverse the controversial and electorally damaging decision to ditch a cap from the Conservative election manifesto, Mr Hunt said it would be reinstated to help spread the risk posed by the "illness lottery" of conditions such as dementia.

    In his first speech since he took responsibility for a Government Green Paper on social care, he said the cap would be part of a number of "risk-pooling" measures.

    Mr Hunt told an audience of health and social workers that funding would be based on "a partnership between the state and individuals".

    As well as a cap, underwritten by Government, the Green Paper is likely to propose a saving or insurance scheme for young people.

    The elderly may face tax rises, perhaps in the form of national insurance for working pensioners, or a levy on property wealth.

    ____________________________

    That's all we need, a tax on property wealth to add to the already ridiculous S24 taxes.

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    An extra tax on working pensioners would go down well!

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    Unbelievable.

    A shot at targeting those who have avoided S24 by incorporating/switching to holiday lets?


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    You can see the logic for taxing property wealth

    It is a mansion tax by the back door.

    The fact that many who are asset rich are also cash poor!

    So what will happen is charges will be levied on the properties to be paid to Govt when the owner sells or dies

    S24 was just the start.

    Corporate LL will be hit now.

    Time to start deleveraging ASAP to ensure resilience  for all the extra property taxes that will be required.

    So perhaps reduce leverage by reducing property numbers means fewer property taxes.

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    Don't we already have that?  It's 40% and it's call inheritance tax.


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    Ah! !! But if you have had the temerity to struggle and work hard to achieve buying your properties then you are deemed fair game to be royally screwed in addition to normal IHT.

    Only greedy avaricious people buy properties and are therefore  considered as tax cows to be milked as much as possible.

    Increasingly Govt will be seeking to tax wealth of any description.

    Property in the SE tends to be a large store of wealth ready to be stolen by Govt.

    As property doesn't tend to move much it makes for an ideal tax target.

    The fact that the property owner may not be able to afford the taxes will be considered as irrelevant by Govt.

    A bit like S24

    If you don't pay Govt will bankrupt you.

    They will sell your assets to get the tax.

    But if you have a large debt associated  with the property it would be difficult  to get any money out of the property asset .

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    Frankly I'm astonished that working pensioners don't currently pay NICs: National Insurance has become a tax on employment, so if you are employed, you should pay NIC. The fact you are drawing a pension as well shouldn't come into it.

    Arguably, however, NICs should return to what their name says they are: they are an *insurance* scheme, designed to protect you against unemployment and general poverty and ill health. State insurance, like private insurance, should be paid by anyone with an income above a certain threshold.

    This means that in order to pay for a higher quality and consistent social care system, NICs should be paid by pensioners as well as the employed and employers. The average pensioner's income is now *greater* than the average employed income, so many pensioners can clearly afford to pay to insure themselves against the risk of dementia and other degenerative illnesses, and the need to receive social care or go into a care home or nursing home due to old age and infirmity. Old people are much the largest users of NHS and social care services, so they should help to pay for them; private insurance against the risk of dementia is extremely high, so it makes sense to spread the cost and have a national insurance scheme for everyone.

    And before the older members of this board use the standard reply of "I've paid into the system all my life, so why should I pay for social care or the NHS now I am retired", I would say: No you didn't! The costs of the NHS and social care were much, much lower when you were working, so you didn't need to contribute as much. People died younger, and there were many more people of working age than there were old people. The situation is quite different now, there are far fewer young people relative to the number of old ones, and the cost of increased longevity, better state pensions, and higher-quality healthcare and social care cannot be covered simply by increasing taxes on working people and employers.

    Something has to give, and the obvious answer is to make pensioners pay NICs as well as income tax, as part of a grand settlement to greatly improve social and nursing care for everyone and integrate it with the NHS. What do other members of this board think?

    Poorer pensioners can obviously be protected by setting the NIC threshold at a decent level.

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    The average pensioner has a higher pension than a working age person. I wish!!.

    Just where do you get your figures from.

    Forced to retire by the law at the time at 65 my income from all my pensions went from a good 5 figure salary to £12,000 pa now. Could you afford NIC's from that?

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    It looks like the average person retiring this year will get almost £20k - https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/pensi...9-900.html

    The ONS reports household income.

    • Median income for retired households continued to increase following the economic downturn and provisional estimates for FYE 2017 suggest it is now £22,400, which is 14.9% higher in real terms than in FYE 2008 (£19,500).
    • By contrast, the provisional FYE 2017 results indicate that the value of median income for non-retired households is £29,300, which is similar to levels seen in FYE 2008 (£29,200).

    With the state pension age increasing the time during which you pay NICs is also increasing.

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    Possibly they could introduce a reduced rate NIC for pensioners to take account of the point that they have already paid a full NIC record for pension & drawing the state pension. This reduced amount would then reflect costs for health care,  etc which for many an elderly person under a private scheme would expensive anyway. Stands to reason to find any reasonable way to alleviate the financial strain the health system is under.


    Current NI for the employed can be greater per month on salary than income tax, yet the NI system has been one which is relatively cheap compared to what you would pay under a private system & has often struggled to provide the funds needed to cover all its set up to cover.

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