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  • Property-a-holics

    You would have to be stupid or brave to BTL



    With a lot of uncertainty in the housing market at the moment due to a possible no deal brexit and even what will happen if brexit does go ahead, and also section 24 and the possibility of stamp duty getting raised even more I think you'd have to be either brave or stupid to be investing in property in the near future.

    I have 3 btl properties and was hoping to continue to grow my portfolio enough to leave full time employment in a few years. Looks like this plan is going to go on hold for a while.

    Is anyone else putting their plans on hold?

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    Alternative view:

    The worse things seem in the market, the better the opportunities are for profit is contrarian investing at its heart.

    Baron Rothschild, an 18th century British nobleman and member of the Rothschild banking family, is credited with saying that "the time to buy is when there's blood in the streets."

    He should know. Rothschild made a fortune buying in the panic that followed the Battle of Waterloo against Napoleon. But that's not the whole story. The original quote is believed to be "Buy when there's blood in the streets, even if the blood is your own."

    Most people only want winners in their portfolios, but as Warren Buffett warned "You pay a very high price in the stock market for a cheery consensus."

    In other words, if everyone agrees with your investment decision, then it's probably not a good one.

    Full/source article 

    The "masses" will believe all the doom and gloom, which means that PRS stock will dry up, and where there is scarcity, there is value.

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    I love when people such as yourself make me think from a different point of view.

    But local to me prices are rocketing and property seems to be selling fast around here. It seems there's only one way to go and that's down.

    Kind of in a sticky patch as to what to do.

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    I don't know your area but it appears it is the complete opposite of mine. Loads of 'Reduced' properties on my Rightmove searches, and those prices are way more than they should be.

    If the figures work, you're certain there is long term demand, and you're in it for the long term, now is possibly one of the best times to buy if it's in the right area.


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    So bide your time and wait for the masses to get worried ... Property declining in value is only an issue if you are selling.  However, if you are buying, it's good news.

    As stated, the more the PRS continues to shrink, the more rents will rise and those remaining will have a far wider choice of better tenants, so we will experience fewer voids.

    Taking a long term view and hanging in there long term with property has always been my philosophy, not to mention not making knee jerk decisions based on media headlines.

    Generally, doing the exact opposite to what the masses are doing has always served me well in the context of property, plus understanding that over a long investment timeline, in hindsight, shows that what felt like a rollercoaster at the time were actually more like speed bumps.

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    Agree with you Vanessa.

    But can't help but to feel that we have been stitched up by the government in the middle of attempting to correct the market.

    Most landlords I presumed have been buying properties in limited company over the pass year or 2 in the hope of building a portfolio. But as we all know running a company will only be worthwhile both in terms of time sorting out extra paperwork, obtaining loan etc... and cost of higher interest rates and accountancy fees etc... if you have about 5 to 8 properties in it. And I suspect, most of us over the last 2 year's have only started a limited company and bought between 1 to 3 BTL now.

    Therefore the extra Extra stamp duty coming in will at least deter most of us coming out of the market for at least a good few years resulting in running a inefficient limited company with between 1 to 3 BTL properties in it.

    Am I the only one concluding the above situation?

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    I never compare what I am doing with other investors.

    There's no-one on here that is doing exactly what you're doing LL-wise, where you're doing it, and how you're doing it, because they weren't buying where you were buying, when you were buying, and for the price you were buying at!

    No 2 investors are the same, or have the same outlooks. There may be a few overlaps, but we're each treading our own paths.

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    ‘Property declining in value is only an issue if you are selling.  However, if you are buying, it's good news.’

    Also an issue if/when you want to get finance/remortgage and your LTVs are suddenly to high without a cash injection?

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    Yes, when was the last time we experience record levels of property prices and share market indexes, not only in the UK, it's in US, Australia etc.... unless the economy cycle does not apply this time round, a crash is round the corner.


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    This does not stop me from expanding at all because each house is a stand alone business unit, therefore if each unit on an individual basis works out then why would you not continue?

    We have to factor SDLT into the purchase set up cost.

    More will sell, prices will go lower, tenant will become better?

    No reason to stop really.

    it is a business.



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    I can only assume you have not been through negative equity back in 2008 where you cannot remortgages your "assets". But hopefully your rental could pay for the extra stamp duty before the property prices recovery start.

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